Now well point out here that the Bosch Gen 4 motor exhibits a similar metallic clacking noise, since its internal gear system also employs a clutch. It isnt a huge difference, but sometimes its just enough for your rear wheel to make it up and over a stubborn tree root or rock ledge. And you're clearly not pedaling, just pure flow. The thing is though, you do actually get used to that noise. Shimanos battery flexibility certainly presents a significant advantage over the likes of Bosch, which is much more limited with its battery options. What's left is just a plain old mountain bike with a weight around 14kg. Your country not there? It's around 300g lighter than the old E8000 it replaces, as well as being much smaller in volume . Can't see the equivalent of a ribbed chainstay protector happening. But would the noise stop us from recommending an EP8-equipped bike? One is a Haibike Fat-Tire with a Yamaha Drive, the second is an absolutely brilliant 40lb (including battery) DIODE from LaMere Cycles in the USA. Just remember to manually unpair your phone from the bike before you start riding again, as the motor wont engage while the system is paired to the app. This also allows brands to more neatly integrate the motor into their frame designs, Canyon having done a particularly swell job with the Spectral:ON. And compared to E8000, the new EP8 motor is considerably more powerful on the trail, whilst retaining the smooth and intuitive delivery that weve always dug about Shimanos drive units. FEATURES. From my experience range is determined by climbing and cadence. 3509 Carlin Springs Rd. Wowzers! That Shimano response was pure gold. Merida was the first to release a 2021 eBike running an EP8 and we've actually already ridden it in this video.For 2021, Merida has added the EP8 a larger 630Wh Shimano battery and improved the . Thank you for the info, so still king of the long travels is Levo - 700 battery + Levo SL with range extender. In the lower settings, youll have to pedal really hard to get maximum support the motor. Still built around a block with 250W power outage under 36V, the maximum torque notably increases by more than 20% or 85N.m. . "Unquestionably, Shimano has the cleanest and sleekest display integration on the market". The lighter weight is a big plus as well. I haven't had the privelage to ride any bosch equiped bikes or other shimano bikes but this thing is so quiet I think it would be hard to find another ebike motor that is more silent. Those Merida ebikes ride quite good too. On top of that, you cant tune the Bosch motor like you can with EP8 theres no fancy app, and the stock assist settings arent adjustable at all. More power, less weight, even more efficient and the biggest battery Shimano offer. > Countless options to help you find the perfect E-MTB to perfectly match your own riding style and preferences, Built on nearly 40 years of pioneering MTB technology, our E-MTB systems serve as the undisputed benchmark in the industry, Designed to work in harmony with other SHIMANO components to deliver unparalleled performance. I chose this bike because it has the EP8 and from research, seems to be the most reliable platform out there, assuming it's as reliable as the E8000. Power less, battery smaller, it lighter is.. Would "every time you push the on switch" have been more understandable? SM-CRE80-R. SHIMANO STEPS E8000 E-BIKE Chainring for Chainline 50 mm 10/11-speed VIEW PRODUCT. What's your experience on this? The EP8 motor and 630Wh battery are both known quantities and we can probably work out how far it will go based on other bikes, but it's an interesting omission nonetheless. On top of that, Shimano also appears to be cool with brands building their bikes with non-Shimano batteries. There is zero stickiness at the pedals that we could detect. View More Close. The new EP8 motor is specced on the Heckler, and the MX wheel size option features Reserve carbon wheels front and back. With the new EP8, Shimano managed to close the gap to its biggest competitors. This is due to the internal clutch mechanism, which allows the motor to disconnect from the cranks when not in use, thereby decreasing drag and resistance. Regardless ebike or "normal" MTB. Shimano Steps E8036 E-Bike Battery Brand: Shimano Type: E-Bike Battery Model: Steps E8036 Frame . Unfortunately this clutch also produces a metallic clack whenever it rotates back and fourth. Generally on bikes we spend so little time braking that regeneration would be a waste of effort. EP8 delivers up to 85 Nm of torque, a 21-percent increase over the STEPS E8000 motor platform. Its clear why this motor is becoming popular with so many bike brands, given the flexibility it offers frame designers, particularly with the variety of battery options on offer. The downside for Bosch is that its display options leave a lot to be desired. Sell it to me, bet ya cant specially at a respectable 90 keys. Maybe it will be good Orbea Rise + range extender , but we have to wait for more information from users. No mention on the worldwide recall of the motor due to issues? Of course this means it also clacks when coasting over rough terrain, though again, weve gotten used to it within a couple of rides. 3. If you don't like e-bikes for whatever reason, you really have no business even commenting on this review. If a dynamo can be worked into the wheel hubs, you may even get near perpetual charging while the system is in use. People know you're not running some old E8000 or E7000 motor. However, where the Bosch Gen 4 feels like a diesel engine at low RPMs, the sporty EP8 drive unit still prefers spinning at a higher cadence. This gives a very wide and flexible power band that does well to match what your legs are doing, making this the go-to, set-and-forget mode for proper off-roading. Simply named by Specialized as the 2.2, the motor continues to offer 90Nm of peak torque, and externally it has the same mounting points and overall shape. @tomdesoals: That excuse that Shimano put out by their customer service dept . Im the worlds biggest ebike fan & I quite agree. Currently, I own two e-bikes with a new 2022 Moustache Samedi 26 Fat 4 with the Bosch Motor on its way. This is because the assistance drops off quite quickly when you stop pedalling, particularly compared to the Bosch motor, which continues to push on for just a fraction longer. A little more overrun from the EP8 motor, and even the option to tune that attribute via the E-Tube app, would be stupendous! I tested a few Merida bikes with Shimano motor and they have some bugs in first versions,quite annoying stupid things force you to reset the bike sometimes. Shimano's EP8 motor will be specced on a range of top brands 2021 eMTB's including the majority of Merida's ebike range which benefits from the extra performance of the EP8. . - Strong but very well-tuned power delivery And that's with the big heavy battery too. This will be a far more accurate method for determining your estimated range. I suppose pedal assist allows you to tackle the more fun/steep/tech climbs but to be effective it needs to be subtle too. In comparison, Shimano motors can be paired with third party batteries, and that opens up greater flexibility for bike designers (see the Orbea Rise and Pivot Shuttle for example). Durability and ease of maintenence is far more important than power in my world. Fitness hasn't a big effect because of all the muscle weight to motor has to carry but doesn't assist pedalling. So despite being an engineer the non-linear noisy nature of the reporting makes it very difficult to plan rides and I almost always finish the last few km without assistance for bigger rides. As well as being smaller, lighter and more efficient, the new EP8 drive unit also packs more punch with up to 85Nm of torque, bringing it up to speed with the latest power plants from Bosch, Yamaha and Brose/Specialized. Also did some trail work. The new assist algorithm is so effective that riders will find that they no longer need to rely on BOOST mode to clear the most difficult sections of the trails they ride. I also have Commencal 2021 meta power sx. Riders will feel a smoother cut off as they reach the maximum assist speed and then benefit from lighter pedaling without assistance. Shimano couples this introduction with an updated E-TUBE PROJECT system. Assistance Start Here you can tweak how quickly the motor responds within the first pedal stroke. Seems quite useful for when pushing the bike up these impossible climbs. Vitus pairs the new, lower-profile Shimano EP8 motor with a bigger capacity 630Wh battery for extended range (on the VRX & VRS). It's like a dirt bike with a 15 mile range. Good thing with Shimano is warranty,at least here in Madrid is almost instantaneous. They must be under pressure to deliver units as this is at best rushed. However the motor operation itself is fabulous, smooth, powerful, feels natural when you ride, you can cover ground like crazy in this thing. it's been quite awhile and still no fix . So many issues that can be simply solved by not having a motor. Wed much rather see battery life displayed as a percentage, and the option to customise the screen. It can now double the range compared to trail mode, becoming a very useful tool for maximizing ride time. @tomdesoals: Ah, thanks I get it. I've had a go on ebikes and think they're fantastic and good fun. Probably more than some rattle. Team Members Only | PIMS | SITE MAP | TERMS OF USE | PRIVACY | 2023 , THE CENTECH GROUP, Inc.All rights reserved. I'd do way more on a big day. Not the first time Shimano has screwed the pooch with recent launches. I have no personal experience riding with pedal assist but when I hear the high whiz from the motor I think that would drive me mad too. Did some rides on a scott e-genius 920(2020) and my biggest one I did was a 115 km with 2000 meters of ascent ,19 km average speed,all in the eco mode and riding some rocky terrain with some tarmac ,fire roads ,very mixed terrain ,and I did got impressed with the power and the range ,didnt got me so tired on the legs its most a cardio ,but dont put more power on them and no more battery capacity,cause it wil make them almost a dirt bike :-((. . if we need that extra push over the cliff, you know what we do, we charge it up to 11. It's kinda frustrating. With that said, all my riding is tough climbs and steep descents, without an e-bike would be walking up a bunch of it. The E-TUBE RIDE app, which turns a smart phone into a cycling computer, provides expanded information and adds ride recording and mapping features. And we certainly wouldnt be upset if Shimano could quieten down the clacking noise. So paired with Shimano's biggest 630wh battery it ensures the Bullit is fully equipped for . Display integration is still the best on the market, even if it only shows five bars of battery level and could easily integrate some more user-friendly features. We need to go deeper. if you success increase speed. Additionally, the maximum torque limit can be set anywhere between 20-85Nm allowing riders to increase their riding range in TRAIL or BOOST modes or increase the off-road capabilities of ECO mode. There are 5 levels of adjustment from Mild to Quick, with the highest setting requiring only a small rotation with light pedal force to engage the motor. BT-E8016 External Battery With 630Wh, you'll be able to ride further without having to stop and recharge. With EP8, the BOOST, TRAIL and ECO modes can be customized with ten different assist curves which control how quickly the power ramps up to match their effort. If you're heading northwest on I-66 W , keep left at the fork to stay on I-66 W. Take exit 66A to merge onto VA-7 E/Leesburg Pike toward Falls Church. It is a feature bro, the sound of pure class. Specializeds Mission Control app continues to be the market leader in terms of connectivity, tuning options and user-friendliness. Why don't you just make 10 be the top number and make that fully charged? capacity longer. View your system settings, assist levels and ride metrics via a 1.6 (inch) color LCD screen for easy on-trail reference. 1. . The World's largest electric mountain bike community. A bit like chain slap when you don't apply force on the pedals. What settings you end up will depend on your personal riding style, and your expectations of range and power output. 630Wh internal battery offers more capacity so you can keep your focus on the next switchback, not the battery indicator. A kilometre later that estimation dropped to 14km, then not long after to 9km, then to 5km, before the motor automatically switched into emergency limp home mode. dont think people would fancy riding a fixie down a trail. Instead of a single assist ratio for each riding mode, the new algorithm constantly calculates the ideal assist ratio for the situation. In addition to those weve tested, youll be able to find Shimano EP8 on the Santa Cruz Bullit & Heckler, Marin Alpine Trail E2, the Commencal Meta Power, YT Decoy,Pivot Shuttle and Mondraker Dusk. Aside from the sound of the clutch, everything else in the "CONS" list can be fixed with software updates. This can allow an easy transition between two different riders with different preferences, or it can be used to build a commuting mode and a mountain biking mode. DISCONTINUED PRODUCTS, SHIMANO SERVICE CENTER | MANUALS & TECHNICAL DOCUMENTS | DISCONTINUED PRODUCTS, Privacy Policy | Cookies Preferences | Terms of Use | Legal info. While weve certainly been impressed by the power, ride feel and tuneability of the Shimano EP8 system, how does it stack up against the likes of Bosch and Brose/Specialized? While some frames will resonate more than others, the noise is otherwise normal, and it doesnt take long before your brain subconsciously ignores it. Quick everyone, it's another article about e-bikes grab the pitchforks! The maximum rider support was raised to 400%, compared to the E8000's 300%. The version I've been riding on was 17,8kg. On one ride with the Canyon Spectral:ON, the range estimation initially showed 25km. You miss that obscure offering from Specialized? Also a big improvement over the prior motor is that the EP8 freewheels easily, so on flats or downhill you can blast away without motor resistance. My brain constantly struggles with whether 2 bars remaining means I have 21% or 59%I would prefer a continuous power bar or percent. Couldn't agree more. BT-E8036, SHIMANO STEPS - Integrated Type Battery for Down Tube - 630 Wh. Click on a component to learn more. However, you do pay for all that refinement and integration. Same with brose 2.1 & their motor failures. Have had my Norco Range LVT with the EP8 for a week and have noticed the noise, maybe once? When new the last bar of charge corresponds to roughly 15-20% charge, but over time this becomes 5-10%. What is rattling? Here youll find three sliding scales for each of the three assist modes (thats Eco, Trail and Boost). If youre sprinting at speed, the Levo feels sticky and lazy in comparison to the drag-free EP8 motor. Climbs really well and descends like a beast. Once again still want to know; is the BB replaceable on these units yet, or are they still landfill waiting to happen? Introducing the new Focus Jam2 and Sam2 your perfect match. 2 bars left on the Shimano display. As mentioned above, the Assistance Character bears the biggest influence on the motors on-trail feel, and dialling this down can make quite a big difference to the amount of range you can get from the battery. Its mostly apparent when freewheeling down really rough trails, but weve been able to detect it when the motor is engaging and disengaging around the 25km/h cutoff on the road, and while cruising over washboard bumps on mundane fireroads. Having spoken with other long-term EP8 and Bosch Gen 4 users, it would appear that for many riders its a non-issue. I have ridden ebikes great fun,addictive, you gain some things , but lose some things as well, like all bikes a compromise. It even surpasses them in terms of noise (very quiet under load) and weight. At full charge in Trail mode it says range is 90km or so but I haven't put that to the test on more mellow trail days but am sure others have. The new magnesium drive unit casing design delivers a 300g weight loss in a 10-percent smaller form factor. "While we dont expect people to ride with their phone on their handlebars when mountain biking" - Buddy, you must not have seen many e-bike riders. Theres still a whirring noise from the metallic gears inside, and the pitch increases slightly at higher cadences. I rode the engine too, the thing is the engine is super quiet once you charge on the pedals, and you've got that annoying rattling noise as soon as you are on the freewheel and cruising down the trail Shim is working on it from what they said. It also depends on the bike too. However, when coasting on rough terrain the unloaded system can exhibit a 'NORMAL' clicking sound that may be detectable to the rider. SHIMANO EP8 RANGE TEST 630Wh - How Many KM Can You Get?? I doubt that, based on my experience with the E8000 and 504 Wh battery. A bike that weighs almost half as much as the rider. Shimano tried to take the Apple approach to antennaegateyou're holding your phone wrongyou're coasting your bike wrong. However, when coasting on rough terrain the unloaded system can exhibit a normal clicking sound that may be detectable to the rider. SM-CRE80-B. In addition to the challenge of having remaining battery life displayed as five bars, the range estimation tends to drop quite quickly during the final two bars. I've never heard the rattling noise that has been posted in the early reviews - the motor is super quiet, so it looks to me like much ado about nothing. Looks like Rocky(Dyname), Giant(Yamaha) and Specialized(Brose) are in for 2021 and Shimano and Bosch are out. e-bikes remove the only non-financial barrier for entry into a sport that historically required at least some small amount of fitness. Its also given us plenty of opportunity to identify all the little quirks, while getting a better impression of long-term durability and performance. Truly unfortunate you lost it. When riding identical bikes in my experience the lighter rider has more battery left even if he or she uses higher assist modes. Annoying rattle, did anyone say that to Shimano when they first introduced the freewheel? You also need a special key to release the battery from the frame, which were not fans of, at least for a mountain bike anyway. By Ralf Hauser Chuckle. Robust and reliable, LINKGLIDE delivers smooth, seamless shifting under power with enhanced durability. Weve found the first two settings to be too weak for e-MTB use, though conversely the highest setting can feel a little too peaky for some riders. Yeah but who needs all that power? At the same time, riders will notice an increase in range simply because the new assist algorithm doesnt waste energy when it isnt needed. I have this motor. - Available on a wide-range of different e-MTBs, - Clacking noise can be annoying The Shimano EP8 user interface is similarly elegant in its design. That rattle would drive me bonkers. Shimano's EP8, short for DU-EP800, features a higher maximum torque of 85Nm compared to the older E8000's 70Nm, topping it by an extra 21%. On my e8000, my impression was (now on a Trek Rail w a Bosch gen 4) that if you were at two bars, you were really at one, and if you were at one, youd better be a couple of blocks from home. Take note of how much elevation you achieve during those rides (elevation is more important than distance when determining range), and keep that number in mind when youre planning future all-day epics. The fact that the EP8 motor uses the same mounting points as the old E8000 motor means there are a few bikes out there that were anticipating will be updated with the new motor like the Norco Sight VLT and Range VLT. I love the progression of Ebikes! - High quality display & controller Eco set to low and all climbing done slowly in good dry conditions with a light fit rider and low rolling resistance tyres? As mentioned earlier, the Bosch motor does feel punchier than Shimano EP8, with noticeably stronger support at lower cadences. If you are disabled and need a motor on your bike in order to ride, I understand. Rob has ridden the bike, so make You must log in or register to reply here. Rattling and lack of update to the battery monitoring is a no go for me, I would just upgrade the battery to the new 620s if i could fit it. Along with a new larger 630Wh battery option, plus updated hardware and software, Shimano certainly hasnt held back with its much-anticipated return fire on the highly competitive and fast-moving electric mountain bike market. EP8 delivers up to 85 Nm of torque, a 21-percent increase over the STEPS E8000 motor platform. Maximum Support: 400% Q-factor: 177mm Battery Capacity: External: 418, 504, 630Wh/Integrated: 504,. New shared architecture Drivetrain components from Shimano. Tackle steep climbs and tough trails with full confidence thanks to 85Nm maximum torque. Their new ride algorithms make the EP8 one of the most natural feeling motors out there, with plenty of power to propel the bike over obstacles, even if Bosch and Brose are still a bit punchier and deliver slightly more power. > Side-by-side, the EP8 motor is slimmer around the belly and so offers a skerrick more ground clearance. Yes, I have done today 97km today and I have 62% battery charge left. Just kidding! The MY21 model also features an updated build kit that. I rode an e bike and suffered a little bit yesterday. SpecializEd # levo SL is a great benchmark Have had a Specialized Levo & sold it due to making weird noises, so yes other manufacturers have problems too, not saying that is easy to get good reliability with new technology, but my Shimano e-8000 motor has been more reliable even is very wet weather! Plus integration looks like shit on those Nox bikes. > No, you're running the latest EP8. MANUALS & TECHNICAL DOCUMENTS The EP8 system is compatible with Shimano's bigger 630Wh batteries. Bailey's Crossroads, VA 22041. Our advice is not to rely on the range estimation in the first place. In the article it is not considered that much of an issue as supposedly trackstands are less common on e-bikes, but if I'd get one (if ever) that would be just what I can imagine myself do. Maybe it's specific to the commencal frame design transmitting sounds? So this one article, about this one e-bike, says to you that ALL e-bikes lack refinement and therefore aren't worthy of you gracing them with your holy ass? High level of water-resistant performance (IPX5) . Hey Ralf Hauser!! A dinamo or recharging when braking or something That's what I'm still waiting for! Please, It appears you're using an old version of Internet Explorer which is, the 471.5mm rear centre on the Giant Trance X E+, that achieves the most discreet integration, the MasterMind TCU display on the new Specialized Levo. It features the new Shimano EP8 motor and a 630wh battery. You are using an out of date browser. Sort Shimano Steps E6010 E-Bike Battery 36V 11.8Ah 418Wh Frame Bl . Your own weight is really the one thing that effects the battery capacity together with tires and the ground surface. - Tuning options are simple and effective HOME The EP8 drive unit shape more smoothly integrates with new e-bike frames for improved ground clearance and a more compact overall package. The freewheel is still in the (regular) rear hub so when you're not pedaling, nothing in the motor-bottombracket assembly should be moving, isn't it? Overall the tuning adjustments are quite noticeable, though wed always recommend only adjusting one parameter at a time to isolate its effect on the trail. Riders can save all of their settings as a profile in the E-TUBE PROJECT app and choose two of their favorite profiles to load onto the bike for easy access on the fly through the handlebar mounted display. The clicking sound has no effect on the function or durability of the drive unit. PRODUCT ON CFR with a 720Wh battery is 21.84 kg, 610g lighter than its 630Wh battery-rocking predecessor. Its easy to modulate via how much pressure youre putting through the cranks and the power delivery is progressive, giving it a very natural feel as a result. He was pretty happy about ANT compatibility. you should ride slow with a good cadence. Next generation e-tube wires have increased speed and bandwidth in a smaller and lighter package. It also benefits from a RockShox ZEB Select RC fork paired with a RockShox Super Deluxe Select R shock. FEATURES Supports sleek frame design Same mount as current BT-E8035 *When compared with a standard Shimano EP8/630Wh battery combo. For a lighter pedal feel than the E8000, the one-way bearing has reduced its rotational resistance, creating a free play. Range will depend on your riding style, ambient temperature and weight. There are five levels of startup assistance available that can further tame the acceleration from a stop for relaxed city riding or apply more power from the get go when starting on steep mountain bike trails.